Comments on: The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/ An Evolving Exploration into the Head, Heart and Hands of Energy Descent Mon, 13 Feb 2012 00:35:27 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Rowena http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62591 Rowena Sat, 02 May 2009 21:05:02 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62591 Fascinating Rob - thank you. Though it doesn't surprise me to hear that he sometimes feels 'bewildered' but thinks public sector should lead by example! (..!) I am heartened to know that even if they don't yet have the confidence to do so much stuff, there is a cultural shift going on and events such as this (which Robert refers to as a meaningless consultation event but which I think is actually much more important than that and over time results in massive shifts in thinking, ideas and ultimately public policy). We have posters at our local bus stop about the horrendous food waste statistics, and climate change and (albeit at a lower level) peak oil are much more in the media awareness. Hey, the Daily Mail and Times are even dishing out free seeds to encourage more people to grow their own. This didn't happen 2 years ago when we started our Forest Row Transition group. We as transitioner might want things to go further and faster, but the process of debate and working out a consensus usually results in overall better outcomes (in economics terms 'global optimisation rather than local optimisations') and we play a part in trying to develop and inform that consensus. Rob - my great respect to you for confronting Ed M with such a question and I look forward to your report of the follow up. Fascinating Rob – thank you. Though it doesn’t surprise me to hear that he sometimes feels ‘bewildered’ but thinks public sector should lead by example! (..!) I am heartened to know that even if they don’t yet have the confidence to do so much stuff, there is a cultural shift going on and events such as this (which Robert refers to as a meaningless consultation event but which I think is actually much more important than that and over time results in massive shifts in thinking, ideas and ultimately public policy).

We have posters at our local bus stop about the horrendous food waste statistics, and climate change and (albeit at a lower level) peak oil are much more in the media awareness. Hey, the Daily Mail and Times are even dishing out free seeds to encourage more people to grow their own. This didn’t happen 2 years ago when we started our Forest Row Transition group.

We as transitioner might want things to go further and faster, but the process of debate and working out a consensus usually results in overall better outcomes (in economics terms ‘global optimisation rather than local optimisations’) and we play a part in trying to develop and inform that consensus.

Rob – my great respect to you for confronting Ed M with such a question and I look forward to your report of the follow up.

]]> By: Matt Day SMTF http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62486 Matt Day SMTF Wed, 22 Apr 2009 10:09:30 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62486 Thanks Rob, good to hear what the Govt. thinking is. Their lack of thought on Peak Oil and energy security is just baffling though - C4 News last night flagged up the Thames power stations 'cluster' plan to pump CO2 from coal-fired plants into the North Sea - carbon capture is the term apparently. Doh! The plants will still be importing coal. As another poster above pointed out, Govt has many close friends in the oil/gas/coal world and the impression they give is that they will be dragged towards reducing dependence on fossil fuels rather than taking a lead. However, communities are taking a lead - through Transition and other Climate Action initiatives and projects (some in our Market Towns) - and let's hope a critical mass builds that influences our politicians more than the power barons. Thanks Rob, good to hear what the Govt. thinking is. Their lack of thought on Peak Oil and energy security is just baffling though – C4 News last night flagged up the Thames power stations ‘cluster’ plan to pump CO2 from coal-fired plants into the North Sea – carbon capture is the term apparently. Doh! The plants will still be importing coal.
As another poster above pointed out, Govt has many close friends in the oil/gas/coal world and the impression they give is that they will be dragged towards reducing dependence on fossil fuels rather than taking a lead.
However, communities are taking a lead – through Transition and other Climate Action initiatives and projects (some in our Market Towns) – and let’s hope a critical mass builds that influences our politicians more than the power barons.

]]> By: DaveDann http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62478 DaveDann Tue, 21 Apr 2009 19:38:16 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62478 "the Government is not financially in a position to do it all alone" They can finance 2 unnecessary wars and an enormous bailout of the bankers. They can print money. It is a question of what they WANT to do. It doesn't matter how charming you find them. Ordinary people know this even if the intellectuals haven't grasped it yet. “the Government is not financially in a position to do it all alone”
They can finance 2 unnecessary wars and an enormous bailout of the bankers. They can print money. It is a question of what they WANT to do. It doesn’t matter how charming you find them. Ordinary people know this even if the intellectuals haven’t grasped it yet.

]]> By: Francis Macnaughton http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62477 Francis Macnaughton Tue, 21 Apr 2009 19:08:31 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62477 Rob, Had you seen the Commons "debate" on Peak Oil in February at http://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2009-02-27a.556.0 ? Perhaps it might be worth getting Barry Gardiner to press your point further from inside the House? Rob,

Had you seen the Commons “debate” on Peak Oil in February at http://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2009-02-27a.556.0 ?

Perhaps it might be worth getting Barry Gardiner to press your point further from inside the House?

]]> By: pete http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62472 pete Tue, 21 Apr 2009 15:42:24 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62472 I agree with you Robert. Transition calls for localisation, people in power won't give it up until the last minute when it will be too late. If they really wanted to they would have put localising practices into operation before now. Pete I agree with you Robert. Transition calls for localisation, people in power won’t give it up until the last minute when it will be too late. If they really wanted to they would have put localising practices into operation before now.
Pete

]]> By: Robert http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62466 Robert Tue, 21 Apr 2009 09:30:02 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62466 The Minister for Energy's girlfriend works for E.ON? Is that trivia? Sounds like vital information to me. Naturally he sounds friendly and approachable, Rob - nobody gets far in politics without people-friendly qualities. But if you think that means he's serious about doing something in the public interest about climate change or energy dependence - think again. This sort of meaningless "consultation" event is just for public consumption - real policy is made through behind-the-scenes access and people like Ms Thornton are, no doubt, superb at facilitating this. The Minister for Energy’s girlfriend works for E.ON? Is that trivia? Sounds like vital information to me.

Naturally he sounds friendly and approachable, Rob – nobody gets far in politics without people-friendly qualities. But if you think that means he’s serious about doing something in the public interest about climate change or energy dependence – think again. This sort of meaningless “consultation” event is just for public consumption – real policy is made through behind-the-scenes access and people like Ms Thornton are, no doubt, superb at facilitating this.

]]> By: Tom A http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62463 Tom A Tue, 21 Apr 2009 08:31:21 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62463 A little bit of trivia about Ed Milliband from Wikipedia: "His current girlfriend is Justine Thornton, a Cambridge-educated barrister with the law firm 39 Essex Street. She specialises in environmental, planning and international law. In this work, she is currently working on projects for the German-owned energy company E.ON UK (formerly called Powergen). The company is proposing new power stations (including the controversial coal-fired plant at Kngsnorth in Kent and planned new nuclear) to be built in the UK." I remember watching Jonathan Porritt on 'BBC Pariliament' in a parliamentary committee on Climate Change about 6 years ago. (A parliamentary committee being something which has direct influence on government bills unlike "The BES.) Porritt was utterly exasperated - despite years of work to get to this point the MP's were stone-walling his arguments when it mattered and consequently the carbon legislation was weak, unenforceable and full of loop-holes. Keep on going Rob you might wear them down eventually! A little bit of trivia about Ed Milliband from Wikipedia:

“His current girlfriend is Justine Thornton, a Cambridge-educated barrister with the law firm 39 Essex Street. She specialises in environmental, planning and international law. In this work, she is currently working on projects for the German-owned energy company E.ON UK (formerly called Powergen). The company is proposing new power stations (including the controversial coal-fired plant at Kngsnorth in Kent and planned new nuclear) to be built in the UK.”

I remember watching Jonathan Porritt on ‘BBC Pariliament’ in a parliamentary committee on Climate Change about 6 years ago. (A parliamentary committee being something which has direct influence on government bills unlike “The BES.) Porritt was utterly exasperated – despite years of work to get to this point the MP’s were stone-walling his arguments when it mattered and consequently the carbon legislation was weak, unenforceable and full of loop-holes.

Keep on going Rob you might wear them down eventually!

]]> By: David Jonstad http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62462 David Jonstad Tue, 21 Apr 2009 08:21:52 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62462 Sweden is often refered to as some kind of role model when it comes to peak oil. I hate to say it, but the Swedish government has pretty much the same approach to peak oil as the UK government. Yes, our former Prime Minister Göran Persson did start up "The commission on oil independence" aiming to make Sweden independent of oil by 2020. But it was based on the false assumption that we can switch from oil to biofuel in ten years time and the commission is now dead and gone. Actually the Swedish Energy Agency haven't cared for any preparations for disturbances in the fuel supply, except the ones they are obliged to by the EU (keeping 90 days of consumtion in stock). Sweden keeps striving for business as usual as all other countries. Sweden is often refered to as some kind of role model when it comes to peak oil.

I hate to say it, but the Swedish government has pretty much the same approach to peak oil as the UK government. Yes, our former Prime Minister Göran Persson did start up “The commission on oil independence” aiming to make Sweden independent of oil by 2020. But it was based on the false assumption that we can switch from oil to biofuel in ten years time and the commission is now dead and gone.

Actually the Swedish Energy Agency haven’t cared for any preparations for disturbances in the fuel supply, except the ones they are obliged to by the EU (keeping 90 days of consumtion in stock).

Sweden keeps striving for business as usual as all other countries.

]]> By: The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62460 The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband Tue, 21 Apr 2009 06:53:00 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62460 [...] Original post by Transition Culture [...] [...] Original post by Transition Culture [...]

]]> By: The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband http://transitionculture.org/2009/04/21/the-big-energy-shift-and-discussing-peak-oil-with-ed-milliband/comment-page-1/#comment-62459 The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband Tue, 21 Apr 2009 06:50:57 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2538#comment-62459 [...] Excerpt from: The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband [...] [...] Excerpt from: The Big Energy Shift and Discussing Peak Oil with Ed Milliband [...]

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