Comments on: The Perils of an Economy Based on Bricks and Boutiques. Colin Hines speaks in Totnes. http://transitionculture.org/2009/02/11/the-perils-of-an-economy-based-on-bricks-and-boutiques-colin-hines-speaks-in-totnes/ An Evolving Exploration into the Head, Heart and Hands of Energy Descent Tue, 09 Mar 2010 23:04:22 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Ed http://transitionculture.org/2009/02/11/the-perils-of-an-economy-based-on-bricks-and-boutiques-colin-hines-speaks-in-totnes/comment-page-1/#comment-61951 Ed Sun, 15 Mar 2009 12:41:36 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2377#comment-61951 Colin Hines has to a certain extent got it right. Thatcher decided that we should base the economy on non-jobs and greed, which is short termism at it's best. Labour continued the rout and is still doing so. As long as we have these sad old parties (Labour,Conservatives and Liberals) involved in running the country we will be in a lose-lose situation. It takes someone with a bit of vision to run a country and this bunch of losers haven't got it. We continue down the path of not producing anything at our peril. We no longer have north sea oil as a buffer and our state schools are turning out politically manipulated morons. Which is I might add one of the targets of successive governments since Harold Wilson, when it was realised that an educated unemployed workforce was dangerous. I remember hearing on the radio in the seventies an economist declaring that Britain would end up being an economic backwater against the rising power of the third world economies. It would seem that this is now being played out in real time. Colin Hines has to a certain extent got it right. Thatcher decided that we should base the economy on non-jobs and greed, which is short termism at it’s best. Labour continued the rout and is still doing so.

As long as we have these sad old parties (Labour,Conservatives and Liberals) involved in running the country we will be in a lose-lose situation. It takes someone with a bit of vision to run a country and this bunch of losers haven’t got it.

We continue down the path of not producing anything at our peril. We no longer have north sea oil as a buffer and our state schools are turning out politically manipulated morons. Which is I might add one of the targets of successive governments since Harold Wilson, when it was realised that an educated unemployed workforce was dangerous.

I remember hearing on the radio in the seventies an economist declaring that Britain would end up being an economic backwater against the rising power of the third world economies. It would seem that this is now being played out in real time.

]]> By: JIMBO http://transitionculture.org/2009/02/11/the-perils-of-an-economy-based-on-bricks-and-boutiques-colin-hines-speaks-in-totnes/comment-page-1/#comment-61837 JIMBO Sun, 08 Mar 2009 19:41:31 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2377#comment-61837 Mrs Thatcher,s dream of a GB funded by a service industry by which she meant the city of London and its institutions has just collapsed. We do not have a manufacturing industry any more courtsy of said Mrs T. So where does the revenue come from to re-vitalise the economy? Without exports we will just live on money raised from taxes via internal service industries and these will run out soon as they are not self substaining.How will we pay for our future? Mrs Thatcher,s dream of a GB funded by a service industry by which she meant the city of London and its institutions has just collapsed. We do not have a manufacturing industry any more courtsy of said Mrs T. So where does the revenue come from to re-vitalise the economy? Without exports we will just live on money raised from taxes via internal service industries and these will run out soon as they are not self substaining.How will we pay for our future?

]]> By: Green New Deal Round Up « the nef triple crunch blog http://transitionculture.org/2009/02/11/the-perils-of-an-economy-based-on-bricks-and-boutiques-colin-hines-speaks-in-totnes/comment-page-1/#comment-61463 Green New Deal Round Up « the nef triple crunch blog Wed, 18 Feb 2009 11:22:20 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2377#comment-61463 [...] Finally, Green New Deal group member Colin Hines has been talking to members of Transition Town Totnes about economics and the role of government.  Read the transcript of his lecture at Rob Hopkins’ Transition Culture blog. [...] [...] Finally, Green New Deal group member Colin Hines has been talking to members of Transition Town Totnes about economics and the role of government.  Read the transcript of his lecture at Rob Hopkins’ Transition Culture blog. [...]

]]> By: DaveDann http://transitionculture.org/2009/02/11/the-perils-of-an-economy-based-on-bricks-and-boutiques-colin-hines-speaks-in-totnes/comment-page-1/#comment-61369 DaveDann Thu, 12 Feb 2009 09:11:14 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2377#comment-61369 Fine talk but doesn't really contain anything new. When considering private versus public sectors we should remember that in the UK problems in the public sector helped the private sector. Remember that in the 40's we started the welfare state and nationalised key industries. However these just seemed to become corrupt and inefficient by the 70's and Labour governments didn't sort out the problems. We failed to manage the public sector correctly. We still haven't got the balance right. Of course I support the idea of creating 'green jobs' but this is easier said than done. You can't just take a hundred thousand unemployed plasterers and employ them to build a railway overnight. Large scale (or a large number of small scale) projects can take years to get off the ground. We now have the wrong skills in the UK - at design, managerial, manual and political levels. If we set up good green projects then the contracts would probably be won by foreign companies! Fine talk but doesn’t really contain anything new. When considering private versus public sectors we should remember that in the UK problems in the public sector helped the private sector. Remember that in the 40’s we started the welfare state and nationalised key industries. However these just seemed to become corrupt and inefficient by the 70’s and Labour governments didn’t sort out the problems. We failed to manage the public sector correctly. We still haven’t got the balance right.
Of course I support the idea of creating ‘green jobs’ but this is easier said than done. You can’t just take a hundred thousand unemployed plasterers and employ them to build a railway overnight. Large scale (or a large number of small scale) projects can take years to get off the ground. We now have the wrong skills in the UK – at design, managerial, manual and political levels. If we set up good green projects then the contracts would probably be won by foreign companies!

]]> By: Andrew Ramponi http://transitionculture.org/2009/02/11/the-perils-of-an-economy-based-on-bricks-and-boutiques-colin-hines-speaks-in-totnes/comment-page-1/#comment-61363 Andrew Ramponi Wed, 11 Feb 2009 15:26:15 +0000 http://transitionculture.org/?p=2377#comment-61363 It sounds like a good talk, and I pretty much agree with the conclusions. Two things though. One, I see the relationship between government and business (to generalise of course) more as one of mutual cooperation, with candid sharing of what is probably the most powerful political tool on earth, deception. They are in cahoots and look after each other. While it seems the bankers get more money, look at the earnings and business prospects of ex-politicians. They often seem to do quite well. Second, from my admittedly limited reading of economic history, Britain started to go seriously wrong economically well before Thatcher and the 1980's, maybe even 100 years before. If anything really accelerated the problem it was the exploitation of North Sea oil and gas which allowed ever more pathological short term thinking about national productivity to take place. And we ended up with an economy based on a combination of financial engineering, IOU's, and selling each other more and more expensive houses. From JP Donleavey Teacher: "Lifes a game boy, a game you play according to the rules". Boy: " If you're on the side of the hot shots its a game all right, but if you aren't with the hot shots what is the game? Nothing. No game". It sounds like a good talk, and I pretty much agree with the conclusions. Two things though.

One, I see the relationship between government and business (to generalise of course) more as one of mutual cooperation, with candid sharing of what is probably the most powerful political tool on earth, deception. They are in cahoots and look after each other. While it seems the bankers get more money, look at the earnings and business prospects of ex-politicians. They often seem to do quite well.

Second, from my admittedly limited reading of economic history, Britain started to go seriously wrong economically well before Thatcher and the 1980’s, maybe even 100 years before. If anything really accelerated the problem it was the exploitation of North Sea oil and gas which allowed ever more pathological short term thinking about national productivity to take place. And we ended up with an economy based on a combination of financial engineering, IOU’s, and selling each other more and more expensive houses.

From JP Donleavey

Teacher: “Lifes a game boy, a game you play according to the rules”.

Boy: ” If you’re on the side of the hot shots its a game all right, but if you aren’t with the hot shots what is the game? Nothing. No game”.

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